ALIPAC: Two Dozen Strong!

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(Sombrero tip to Immigration Cut and Paste)

William Gheen, President of ALIPAC, truly is the leader of a national movement.  A movement of two dozen people that is. 

It was May of 2008 when ALIPAC announced the launch of a North Carolina "campaign to thwart illegal aliens and their supporters".  Soon after they bullied a local Charlotte newspaper columnist, Mary Schulken, for writing an article entitled "This Tide of Meanness has to Stop".  All of it building up to a big rally to pressure North Carolina legislators to support a horrific "attrition through enforcement" agenda.  Here's how the rally went:
Immigration Rally in Raleigh Draws Sparse Crowd

RALEIGH - About two dozen people gathered in Raleigh on Wednesday to encourage state lawmakers to do their part in supporting immigration enforcement measures and to make North Carolina a less-attractive state for illegal immigrants.
North Carolina legislators must be shaking in their boots. 

Brittanicus, a retiree who therefore can "spend ample time getting [ALIPAC's] message out", offers an explanation for the poor showing in the comments:

Is it any wonder that legal residents or citizens, will not attract attention of radical organizations from third world countries, by protesting[?] In California your marked for death by gang members who are protected by 'Sanctuary laws' like Special Order 40.
Profiles in courage, anyone? 

Let's contrast this fear of fictitious gang members, with what migrants and their supporters went through to march on May 1st of this year:

Migrants have survived the most powerful government in the world spending billions to stamp out their existence.  They have survived thousands of raids terrorizing their communities and breaking apart their families.  They have survived the hordes of nativists that have given up on mass deportation and settled instead on attrition warfare, in an attempt to make life so miserable for migrants that they leave on their own. 
Roberto Lovato has a good piece on this, too, entitled, "Still They March: Nationwide Rallies Highlight Failure of War on Immigrants".  While the "national" group ALIPAC struggles to get more than 30 people to show up,  the pro-migrant movement was able to get 30,000 people to show up just in Wisconsin.  That's right, 1000 to 1.

Let's not forget to mention that one of those two dozen people at the rally was a law-breaker himself, Chris Simcox. 
Rep. John Blust, R-Guilford, says "the people coming into the country should have to follow the law" at the same time that he speaks alongside someone who was arrested for federal weapons charges

This is just another lesson.  Though self-proclaimed "anti-illegal immigration groups" are loud, they are a small and increasingly irrelevent minority.  If retirees like Brittanicus are any indication, most of them probably spend more time commenting on immigration articles than anything else.  They are William Gheen's 80-year-old "internet fighter pilots", who spend all of their time writing nativist comments online, at the same time that they are sustained by social security and the billions of dollars that migrants pay into it.


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When I started my pro-migrant blogging in 2006, I felt alone.  There were millions marching on the streets, but online, I was shouting into the darkness.  I'll never forget that one of the first people that linked to me was... Read More


Mari de G said:

Some people call this kind of organizing "astroturf" -- looks like grass, but no roots. I'm glad to know that Gheen's lot are as thin on the ground as ever.

SJ Reidhead said:

You have truly made my day!

The Pink Flamingo

Tech363 said:

Laugh now, the bus will be picking you up shortly for a free trip back home. The free ride will soon be over.

kyledeb Author Profile Page said:

I'm glad you liked it. Someone just commented over at The Sanctuary and said that they actually hired homeless people to hold signs. I have no way of verifying whether that's true or not, but it certainly adds to the hilarity.

kyledeb Author Profile Page said:

I like it "astroturf". It describes ALIPAC perfectly.

kyledeb Author Profile Page said:

Lovely. Another nativist troll that wants to deport everyone that he/she disagrees with.

Radioiactive said:

It's funny how one low attendence event can be milked to death by pro-illegal supporters. You'll still be spouting off about this for months to come, go ahead, since it's about all you have.

If you bothered to look, you'll see most ALIPAC members are hard working Americans who are struggling to make ends meet and unlike illegals, don't have illegal employers granting them weekdays off to march in the streets or protest immigration laws they ignore anyway.

Yes, some are retired, some are disabled, and some can't get to events for various reasons. For those WE HAVE THE INTERNET and the facts on the destruction caused by illegal immigration are out there, but when you don't like the responses all you can do is name call; trolls, etc.

Keep on milking this one, it's all you've got.

kyledeb Author Profile Page said:

I don't usually publish comments from ALIPAC supporters on Citizen Orange. Those that don't know how easily the Internet can be manipulated sometimes convince popular support with the dozens of supporters anti-migrant organizations have sitting at their computers typing anti-migrant comments everywhere.

I'm publishing this comment to respond to your assertion that everyone I disagree with I call a "troll". First of all, I can say the same thing for your side. You label all of us "open-borders", "pro-illegal", "amnesty supporters", but worst of all you use the word "illegal alien" to dehumanize millions of people in the U.S. That, however, does not give me the right to give ALIPAC supporters nasty names, and I will be the first one to admit that sometimes I go too far.

But, in this context, with troll, I'm not going too far. I was referring specifically to the person above that suggested I should be deported back to Mexico. That assertion is ridiculous, since I am a U.S. citizen, and completely deserving of the label troll. If you want me to define it for you, here it is:

An Internet troll, or simply troll in Internet slang, is someone who posts controversial and usually irrelevant or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum or chat room, with the intention of baiting other users into an emotional response or to generally disrupt normal on-topic discussion.

I was not off by using that label here.

Regarding your whole assertion that we're going to milk this one event to death, this isn't the first time there has been a poor showing of "anti-illegal immigration" supporters. Symsess from American Humanity agrees. In fact, I challenge anyone in this thread to show me any anti-migrant demonstration that has even come close to a pro-migrant demonstration's size.

You assert that "illegals" (another innacurate, ungrammatical, and offensive label) are able to demonstrate because they get time off from their employers, which is completely untrue. Migrants and their supporters face more barriers than ALIPAC supporters ever will in going out to demonstrate.

Nativists talk a big game, but when it comes time to actually show their numbers and demonstrate, they're nowhere to be found. When it comes time to show their numbers at the voting booth, their nowhere to be found, as evidenced by the inability of migrants to be a winning electoral issue at almost every level in the U.S. ALIPAC, NumbersUSA, FAIR, and all the other front groups for the same agenda, would like the U.S. public to believe that they're strong because they can get a few dozen people to comment endlessly on newspaper articles online, but we know the truth is they have nothing.

symsess said:

klyedeb is absolutely right. I can attest that no anti-migrant rally in the New Jersey area ever gets much support and many in the audience are from white supremacists organizations. They're always willing to lend support to these groups. One group had a highly hyped rally in Harrisburg, PA last year only to see a hundred people show up. Many of the people they 'counted' were probably walking by as there was also a multi-cultural festival ironically happening in the same area.

Other rallies of little support were held in Morristown, NJ, Lakewood, NJ (two rallies here one of which required a ticket to enter), Freeland, PA and Wilkes-Barre, PA. Every one of these rallies begins with the assertion that a low turnout does not mean little support though this quickly turns into a cry that nobody will 'stand up' for their country. The only rally with decent attendance was held in Hazleton and that was a few hundred strong. The proudest moment of this rally was when the crowd yelled to a Hispanic U.S. citizen to "go home." (video link.)

DinTN said:

"someone who posts controversial and usually irrelevant or off-topic messages in an online community,"

My comment was in no way "off topic". You talk about low numbers from ALIPAC, and I gave several reasons. How much on-topic do you need? Oh, you only accept comments you agree with, forget about how reasonable they might be.
Pro-illegals may have had more marchers in the street, but we obviously make more impact with contacting our representatives and voting.
If you think we don't have numbers on our side, just remember it was ALIPAC, along with numbersusa and others that stopped the amnesty last June, and don't forget the DREAM Act...

I'm obviously through here :)

El Guapo said:

A couple of years ago I went to see a Minute Man rally on Capitol Hill just to watch it. There were literally more press there than Minute Men. There were about 50 people total.

I chuckled when one of the head minute men stood at the podium and threatened Congress saying that they would be voted out if they are soft on illegal aliens. With such a small crowd backing him up, I doubt anyone in Congress was concerned.

It was pretty funny.

kyledeb Author Profile Page said:

I wasn't referring to you as a troll, but the person before who left a comment that in effect said I should be deported.

I do not only accept comments I agree with, I just ask that people posting here be willing to have an honest debate and work towards solutions. Words like "pro-illegals" certainly don't put you in a category that makes you welcome here.

I disagree, organizations like ALIPAC are not making a huge impact. All of your anti-migrant presidential candidates are out of the race, and in local elections you are all not fairing much better except in a few pockets.

Giving ALIPAC and Numbers USA credit for the defeat of CIR neglects the fact that a lot of pro-migrant organizations opposed it as well for all of its harsh enforcement.

All of this just goes to show that the only thing your side is interested in is spreading lies, and the same old talking points.

kyledeb Author Profile Page said:

Hey El Guapo,

Welcome to Citizen Orange.

That's the ridiculous thing about all of this, is that the press actually reports on things like this. The other side is so good at making a lot of noise and making a show, when in actuality they have no real grassroots support. They talk a big game, but they've got nothing. Even Jim Gilchrist, founder of the Minutemen, just derided the movement for how crazy it has become.

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This page contains a single entry by kyledeb published on June 20, 2008 1:11 AM.

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